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Just another one of my character ideas.

Star Wars has had many different types of "unsavory" characters--bounty hunters, crime lords, smugglers, loan sharks, slavers, thugs, gamblers, mercernaries, drug dealers, assassins, and Methodists--but no "freelance wealth redistribution specialists" (as Haley Starshine from the Order of the Stick refers to herself) as such that I know about.

So I've come up with a concept for a thief/cat burglar.

Mariah Tokani (CL 8 )

In her own mind, Mariah is the best thief in the Galaxy. She has made a decent living robbing, swiping, purloining, acquiring, and securing valuables for various clients in her nefarious career. She has her own personal code of honor; she will avoid harming innocent people in the process of pulling a caper at all costs, and will not steal from the poor, charitable organizations, or take items where taking them would harm a significant number of beings (such as needed medicines). Mariah hopes to make that one "Big Score" and be able to retire to someplace nice, such as Zeltros or the upper cities of Coruscant or Taris, and not to an Imperial detention facility.



(yes, I envisioned her as resembling Summer Glau. So sue me.)

Medium Human Scoundrel 1/Scout 7

Force 9
Init +12; Senses Perception +16
Languages Basic, Huttese, Shyriiwook
Defenses Ref 23 (flat-footed 20), Fort 21, Will 21
Melee Stun baton +8 (2d6+6)
Ranged Bluebolt blaster pistol +9 (3d8+4) or
Ranged Bluebolt blaster pistol +7 (4d8+4) with Rapid Shot or
Base Attack +6; Grapple +9
Attack Options Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot
Special Actions Fool's Luck
Abilities Str 14, Dex 16, Con 14, Int 14, Wis 14, Cha 10
Talents Blend In, Fool's Luck, Hidden Movement, Improved Stealth, Total Concealment
Feats Gearhead, Informer, Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot, Skill Focus (perception, stealth), Skill Training (climb), Weapon Proficiency (pistols, rifles, simple weapons)
Skills Acrobatics +12, Climb +11, Initiative +12, Mechanics +11, Perception +16, Pilot +12, Stealth +17, Use Computer +11
Possessions Bluebolt blaster pistol, utility belt, security kit, tool kit, 5 additional liquid cable dispensers, Vid-Vox scrambler, Arakyd Hush-About jet pack

Level 1: Scoundrel; Talent: Fool's Luck; Feats: Point Blank Shot, Weapon Proficiency (pistols, simple), Precise Shot, Skill Training (Climb)

Level 2: Scout; Talent: Improved Stealth; Feats: Weapon Proficiency (rifles)

Level 3: Scout;Feats: Informer, Skill Focus (Stealth)

Level 4: Scout; Talent: Hidden Movement; Stat Bumps: Strength, Dexterity

Level 5: Scout; Feats: Gearhead

Level 6: Scout; Talent: Total Concealment; Feats: Rapid Shot

Level 7: Scout; Feats: Skill Focus (Perception)

Level 8: Scout; Talent: Blend In; Stat Bumps: Strength, Dexterity

Which brings me to the subject of prestige classes. This character qualifies for both Infiltrator and Vanguard. Which one (or which combination of the two) would you use for such a character? I'm very interested in seeing your builds and ideas.

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When asked why there was only one set of foot prints Jesus replied, "The Sand people ride single file to hide their numbers."

Half of the Vanguard talents are teamwork-based, so I was originally going to suggest Infiltrator. However, the Vanguard talents Maximize Cover and Impenetrable Cover look interesting, especially if your character uses cover a lot. Feats that would work well with these talents are Advantageous Cover and Trench Warrior.

Also, Invisible Attacker (also a Vanguard talent) is interesting. If you combine that with the Deadly Sniper feat, you will gain +2 attack bonus and +2 dice damage against opponents who are unaware of you. This is in addition to the bonus you gain from the Surprise Attack Vanguard class feature.

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Saga Edition RPG resource documents & reference tools:
Compiled files of all resource documents & reference tools- NPCs, character sheets, DoD, Saga Index to all feats, talents, species, weapons, etc, Star Wars web enhancements

You may not care anymore but my selection would be to split Vanguard4/Inflitrator4 with the final four levels going to one or other or something completely different. The levels in Vangard keeps the BAB up, gets you the +4 FORT Defense, and has the Survivor talent tree available to it if nothing else. Infiltrator gets you the +4 REF Defense which is nice and I'd shoot for the 4th or 8th level exit points for Lead Infiltrator in case you ever need/want to bring someone else along.

Now if building the "ultimate" thief/burglar you could also consider a dip into Soldier for light armor proficiency and Armored Defense which would allow you to wear light armor equiped with shadowskin to boost your stealth even more. I also think that Force Users can make excelent infiltration specialists if you consider the Phase and Cload Force Powers amoung other things.

StevenO, what are "4th or 8th level exit points"? Do you mean points at which you might exit a prestige class?

HEY! I resent that last one.
I'm no Methodist!

(Actually I really am. )


If you look at your BAB progression for a low-BAB class, 5th and 9th level are where you don't gain a point of base attack. If you swap out earlier than that and take levels in another low-BAB class, you wind up with a penalized BAB. This isn't a concern if you're multiclassing into a full-BAB class, but in general you want to take 4 or 8 levels of low-BAB classes to get your best result.

edit: Fixed my inability to do math while distracted.

In this case yes. When I look at the Infiltrator class I'd figure on taking it for either four or eight levels to get those abilities that I can use with my allies while also keeping my BAB up. I don't know if I like the talents enough to justify a one or three level dip into the class and if you do get three you should get four because I'm sure you'll have a clutz ally who could REALLY benefit from using your Stealth.

Although there are houserules to work around it I rarely find levels 9 and 10 of a 3/4 BAB PrC appealing to me unless it is a pure support type character. The class ability for 10th-level needs to be good and that talent I get at 9th also should be good to justify the loss of BAB.

Just looking it seems to me that DarthP needs to reevaluate.The question with 3/4 BAB classes is whether or not to take that 4th/8th level or if you should find something else. Neither level grants a talent but if the special you get there is good it may be better then taking some other class which will still advance your BAB.

When I look into any 3/4 BAB class I normally look at taking one or three levels if I want one or two talents from it. I then look at taking the next even level if I can find it helpful. I rarely look at taking them at levels 5+ because of that second BAB hit so if I do I should be getting things I can't get anywhere else.

I was at work and got busy and I didn't check the tables. As should be obvious, I miscounted. I was agreeing with you. Fixed my numbers in the previous post.

Much of the time I'm posting just waiting for something to come in and pull me away. When it comes to BAB and special abilities SAGA is pretty straight forward and there is usually little need to check the tables. Basically EVERY time a character gets an odd class level he gets a talent (and occasionally something else) although what they get on even levels varies.

I know part of my worry is that when you mentioned 3rd and 7th levels those actually can be good exit points for many classes as you get your 2nd or 4th talent from those classes if that's what you're shooting for. I know I often have a hard time seeing why someone goes with 4th-level in some base classes when you could have gone with a bigger HD class and still gotten the same results in most cases. For example Scoundrel4/Solder3 vs Scoundrel3/Soldier4.

Right, and if you're going into or leaving a full-BAB class like Soldier, Jedi, or some PRCs, then it's not a big deal; you can take any number of levels in the first class and switch out at any time without penalty. But if you're going from one partial to another, unless the GM houserules fractional BAB addition (that is to say, a Scout 1/Scoundrel 1 has the same BAB as a Scout 2 because either way, you have two levels in a partial-BAB class), you hurt yourself by leaving that class without having 4/8/12/etc levels in it.