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So far, from what I've read, besides expense, the 2 biggest downsides for the viability of this line are
1--Very era-specific. Maybe it made it easier to get the line launched and keep the page count reasonable, since there would be limited Force-related mechanics & fluff. But, & I've touched on before, this is going to narrow the market--a lot IMO. While we love Rebellion era, most of us want to be able to play other eras an even infinities. Something you could do with any of the d20/Saga core books. (Probably d6, but I'm not familiar enough to comment) Sure you could homebrew, but why, when there's already so much ready to use out there?
2--The long timeline for publication. (And doubts about how well the books will mesh) Players who want lots more Jedi-type content won't want to wait until 2015, not when they can pull at least 1 other complete line off their bookshelves & get started.

Even though I'm giving this a try, both of these make me wonder--is FFG hoping the game isn't popular? That they only did an RPG because the contract required it? Do just enough to fulfill that clause & focus on the board & minis games that might have been all they really wanted out of the license?

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Arkansas Regional Captain & proud member of Spice Runners Squadron
Kessel Base, The Rebel Legion

"The bad guys hardly ever quote Star Wars."
Harry Dresden, Cold Days

I haven't been able to look at it yet, since I haven't ordered a copy. And I won't, either. At least not until the final release. It has nothing to do with the dice or anything else related to the game. For me, it's a simple fact of being a new dad, and plunking down $40 for a beta is not on my list. I know the game will be released next year, and I can save up for it. I already put aside a bit of money each month for gaming expenses, so it's not a big deal for me to wait.

My concerns have been expressed by others, so I"m not going to rehash them here, but I will add that my home group's other GM is being stubborn about it. She seems to be under the influence that she will be perpetually stuck only running one story with the FFG game, and I'm unable to see where she gets that from. She will be a tough one to get to at least try the game.

I'm also curious if they will be releasing additional books for other era's or equipment or anything?

Each year they intend to have one "major release" standalone/seamless integrated book, (the other two main books expected, Rebellion and Force, respectively) but I believe additonal supplements are in the works for between the primary game book releases.

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FULONGAMER aka Johannes M. Bowers
http://thelostholocronpodcast.info/
It's not My planet Monkey-boy! / I Waste Him With My Bowcaster!
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That remains to be seen, but so far, the only three releases we have for the game is firmly Rebellion Era, though the focus will shift from book to book. This one focuses largely on life in the Outer Rim and the smugglers and bounty hunters that make their livings out there. The next book will focus on the Rebellion and the fight against the Empire and the third and final release will bring the spotlight around to full-powered Force users (at least from the sounds of it) hiding and fighting against an Emperor that wants them made extinct.

As for one story? I'm not sure where she's getting it either. Maybe she was fed some wrong information or took something the wrong way, but there's millions of places you could go with this book. As I've been reading through it, I'm blown away by just how much stuff is packed into it. Yes, it's more thematic in it's presentation than Saga Edition was, but there's so many places you could go with that theme. You could be smugglers running guns for the Rebellion or local militia. You could be space-age river boat gamblers looking for the next big score. You could be part of a space age cowboy posse on a backwater world protecting it from gangs of toughs and natural enemies. You could do so many things with the theme that it makes my head spin just thinking about it, and that's what it's really there for - to serve as a launching point for people to take their own adventures.



Where you see a problem with viability, I see a strength. Then again, I'm an (as I once called Dono), irascible system tinker monkey. I love the fact that there's a lot of stuff that I can pull from either Saga Edition or WEG and convert it. But I can totally see where others may not get that same sense of enjoyment as I do over it.



Yeah, but how long was the Saga Edition Core Rulebook out before Starships of the Galaxy and Threats of the Galaxy were printed? There was quite some time before we got into era specific stuff as well.

This also goes back to the idea of "borrowing." This system looks to be pretty forgiving of house-ruling things so far, so people who want more Jedi-type content should be pretty easily able to plug their own stuff in using what's presented in Edge of the Empire as a baseline to go by.



I don't think we have to worry about that. They wouldn't have brought someone like Sterling Hershey onto the project if they weren't serious about it. I remember when Chris and Dave talked to the guys at GenCon last year, they were all super excited about being able to work on Star Wars, as they were all huge fans.

It's just a different experience than people who have been playing Saga Edition for the last five years are used to. The tighter thematic presentation is something that people coming from that game are getting used to. But from my understanding, the people who have been playing FFG games for longer (such as their 40k line) are very used to that, and it's been quite successful for them.

*shrug*

Just my thoughts on the issues.

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I spoke with the FFG rep at CVI regarding eras. My impression from him (if I understood correctly) was that they will release books for individual eras that will each comprise a complete rule set. So if you only want to play the Old Republic era, you can purchase just that one book to have a complete game ruleset (that is era specific regarding careers and talent trees, etc.) - though they will all use the same mechanic. [EDIT - Though when/if they are released is yet to be seen.] Interesting concept.

After constructing my first character, here are my reflections (for what they're worth):

1. Much more parity from character to character. No more lucky player who rolls great stats vs. the poor schlep who gets a 17 for one attribute and 10's for everything else.

2. I like the fact that there are no levels. This makes complete sense to me. I've never liked the leveling system. Actually, I recently made a prototype of my own RPG (modern spy/specwar game) and I did away with levels. That's just not how a life is lived.

3. I like the fact that skills and talent trees are not restricted to career. While you can purchase skills/talent trees for fewer XP if they're in your career, you can still get ahold of other skills and trees (for additional cost, of course). It always bugged me in Saga that a soldier couldn't learn Stealth without dipping into a different class. That's something most real soldiers learn right away.

4. I'm not sure what I think of the dice pool system. I have to see it in action, but with my test rolls I think it will work pretty well. I was surprised to learn at CVI that the app wasn't free (that earned the FFG rep a raised eyebrow from me - for what it's worth). But I did purchase it anyway. It's actually a very nice app IMHO. An it should greatly enhance play even when the actual dice become available.

5. I like that the game stresses more of the role-playing aspects via the obligation and motivation systems. This is kind of (but not quite) a systemized version of GM Chris' famed '3 questions'.

6. As others have stated, with no battle map, I expect this system to be very friendly to PbP and (to a lesser extent) Skype games. I've used Skype in Saga games and found it to leave much to be desired.

That's my take so far. Though I was very skeptical at first, the more I learn of the system, the more I'm actually a little excited about it.

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aka Jim Jedi-Scramble

Quoting from the Saga Edition Core Rulebook: "The galaxy is a dangerous place (p. 143)...bad things happen sometimes. (p.246)"

HA! Mr. Hershey's name escaped my notice in the "Writing and Development" credits. I'm happy to learn that he's involved.

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aka Jim Jedi-Scramble

Quoting from the Saga Edition Core Rulebook: "The galaxy is a dangerous place (p. 143)...bad things happen sometimes. (p.246)"

There wasn't really an expanded universe beyond Splinter Of The Mind's Eye and the Han Solo trilogy when the D6 first edition came out (it was '87/'88 if I remember rightly, and we wouldn't get Heir To The Empire for another four years or so!)

The Jedi weren't really defined outside of what we saw in the OT, and their Force wielding hadn't gone into the bounds of the ludicrous (I'm looking at you Fold Space!).

If this new game can recapture that early feel, I'm going to be very happy.



I don't think any games company is going to lay out a load of cash on development with a view towards failure, not in the current economic climate. They're probably just following the patterns established with the 40K games, which are obviously a big success for them. We could play the Inquisition when the first game launched, but it was a year before we got to Rogue Trader, and another one to be a Space Marine, each game stepping up the power level.

It makes sense to start with rogues and scoundrels anyway, even beyond the "low power level" aspect - "1313", a gritty look at Coruscant's undercity, is on its way, the long discussed live TV series is focussed on the underworld, and Timothy Zahn's forthcoming new novel "Scoundrels" is an Oceans 11 style caper.

So, in a sense, it's similar to Saga in that there are (possibly, if you understood correctly) going to be other Era's produced. This pleases me, and makes me even more interested in the game. I'm already interested, just waiting as per my reasons posted before. If this does turn out to be true, then selling said GM on it will be far easier than I thought.


This sounds interesting. So the abilities are more even?



This again interests me. I can't wait to try it. I'm horrible at PbP (I suck at writing), but maybe I can get in on a Skype game....



I'm not exactly super excited for the dice, mostly because I'm so used to my beloved d20. I'm not going to dismiss this either as it sounds fun.



Everything else just makes me want to try the game. Does the way the dice and other pool mechanics feel like they take things out of the hands of the GM? My friends feels that way, which is why she's being stubborn, next to the one era part. I don't think it would, but I'm also the guy who was willing to try Rogue Trader and still wants to try that game.

For product releases, I'd imagine FFG would follow a similar mold to WFRP3e and W40K, with one Major product release each year (the so-called "core setting books") followed by a number of smaller in-between releases (monster/threat manuals, adventures, specific setting guides, and so on). Granted, I don't think we're going to see much in the way of official material until the end-product version of Edge of Empire gets released, as FFG is boudn to want to focus on getting the core rules of their game set and in place.

Now while Saga Edition did have a huge gap between when the Core Rulebook got released and the initial two supplements, part of that really wasn't WotC's fault. They had tFUCG set and ready to go, but couldn't release it due to the video game that was the core product of the whole multi-media tie-in getting pushed back almost a year from it's proposed release date. And it was made pretty clear from the word go that SWSE wasn't WotC's primary concern, only getting one sourcebook each quarter on average after the timing issue with tFUCG was resolved.

Much as I love to tinker with RPG rulesets, there also comes a point of diminishing returns. Why should I convert several books worth of pre-existing material from a perfectly viable RPG to a brand-new system? Maybe back in my college days I would have done so and done it gleefully, but I'm an older gamer, and doing all this conversion work for a new system doesn't have the same appeal that it used to. That said, I've got some ideas rolling around in my head to expand on the Force Sensitive Exile a little and maybe even brew up a Jedi Trainee specialization; trust me, this won't me Prequel-era level of Jedi, more like pre-ESB Luke or the Minor Jedi and Failed Jedi templates from the WEG days.

I did build my first character last night, a Human Force-sensitive Smuggler/Scoundrel, and I am very much reminded of the way in which WEG kept Force-users in line (at least in the early going) by having you pay (and possibly pay quite a lot) to get your Force abilities and powers. In WEG, you had to sacrifice starting ability score dice to get that initial Force Power die, as well as skill points to increase them beyond the basic level. EoE is similar, as I noticed that the points I spent on Kyrin's limited Force abilities could have easily been used to boost up more skills or raise one of his characteristics up a notch.

I've also talked this over with both of my usual gaming groups, and there does seem to be some interest in at least trying this out. I'm considering modifying the old "A Much Larger Galaxy" and using that, or possibly even tweak the intro adventure in the back of my copy of WEG's Star Wars Revised & Expanded rulebook. Only problem is (to an extent) the dice, as not all the folks I game with are willing to drop $5 on a dice-roller app for games they might never play more than once or the hassle of printing out the dice stickers. But that will be a "take it as it comes" sort of deal.

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"If you've never seen an elephant ski, then you've never been on acid."
- Eddie Izzard

Contributing Author of the GSA
Dono's Gaming & Etc Blog
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No more than any random element takes something out of the hands of an individual. In fact, these dice mechanics encourage the players to add to the overall narrative. The dice accrue Successes, Advantages, Triumph (Advantages on steroids), Failures, Threat, and Despair (Threat on steroids). Successes and Failures interact like you think they do. Advantages and Threat are the wild cards. There are some codified ways they can be spent, like to activate weapon abilities or to recover during combat, but they can also be spent in other ways to enhance the story. The GM of course, always has final say whether or not something is appropriate, but it does encourage player creativity.

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Why convert anything at all? This is a chance to start again, with a fresh viewpoint and a different mindset, both in terms of the game's focus, and the new system. You're right, you can already play all that stuff you have already, just like I could pick up SAGA again, or even WEG, but this is a chance to do something new, so personally I'm taking it as an opportunity to do stuff I haven't already done.

My own players are really up for it, but I suppose we have the advantage that everyone prefers the original trilogy to the prequels, and everyone is burned out on the Old Republic

Ran our first adventure last night and our group loved the narrative die pool and had a great time. Combat went extremely quick and resulted in a number of epic blaster fights (probably going to introduce a larger space battle in the next session, this was more of a Maltese Falcon looking for the Black Bird type adventure)... By the time we were half way through the PCs first encounter they were putting together their own pools without assistance and throwing out narrative suggestions to add bonuses to their dice.

My group definitely plans to continue with this system.

As a side: http://futileposition.com/2012/08/star-wars-edge-of-the-empire-rpg-beta-character-differentiation.html

The system does a fine job allowing you to create the character you want... you can buy any skill, you're just going to pay more for it if it's outside your career.

Yancy

I said in the chat for the last order 66 cast that I wouldn't be getting the beta because all I'd get to do with it is read it for the entire year (My group only managing to get together rarely, and still enjoying our Saga campaign). Then I suddenly found myself in possession of extra spending money and wasted no time making a liar of myself . The book will be arriving on my doorstep soon.

As someone who loves option heavy character creation, this makes me extremely excited. I can't wait to read the rules for myself.

I love the Saga system. But if I have any complaint, it's that combat encounters can take soooooo long (especially with a larger group). Though I haven't played it yet, my thoughts are that combat would go faster with this system since it is more abstract. So it will be more like the old D&D that I used to play.

I also assume that this is more like the WEG system. I once adapted the WEG "Domain of Evil" to Saga for one of my groups. It took forever due to all of the combat encounters. I figure that combat must have gone faster under the WEG system.

My only problem is that I really like maps in general. So I figure under this system I will still use maps. It's just that they won't be proper battle grids like in Saga. In a way this is liberating because you can make a map to whatever scale suits the tactical situation. This is something that I did anyway (and I know many posters on this forum have done too) using some house rules (to have one square represent 6 sq of character scale, for instance). This way the sniper in my group could really shine. This will be easier to pull off in the FFG system perhaps.

Actually, come to think of it, I bet the old WEG modules will be easily adapted to this system - much more easily than to Saga. Heck, they're even in the correct era.

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aka Jim Jedi-Scramble

Quoting from the Saga Edition Core Rulebook: "The galaxy is a dangerous place (p. 143)...bad things happen sometimes. (p.246)"

Not only faster due to the abstracted system, but from what I'm reading, baddies go down a helluva lot easier and more quickly (though your characters are a little bit squishier as well).

Combat in WEG was quite a bit faster than Saga Edition as well. Compare the result of the damage die against the target's Strength score and find out how bad you hurt him. No hit points or CT movement to keep track of, just how bad someone's hurt.

Don't get me wrong. I love Saga Edition and the CT, but a quick, clean, deadly combat system rubs me in all of the right ways (one of the reasons I'm such a huge fan of the One Roll Engine).

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